Having spent some time with the books in question, indeed a great amount of my time at work is spent, not toiling over documents or spreadsheets, but merely browsing the new edition's features, I feel I should collect my thoughts on the matter.
I must say that although my cynicism prevents me from ever remarking upon it's supposed greatness, the new edition isn't altogether bad.
I know, what a shock. They have succeeded in making an exception-based system, and have too succeeded in making me mildly enthused to see the game in practice. (I greatly enjoyed the PA/WotC podcast, though that may be in part to Mike, Scott and Jerry and less in part to Wizards.) The greatest point of contention, at least for me, from 3rd Edition has largely been done away with, in that there is no disparity between supposed and real power levels of certain class mixtures or distillations. The way they have accomplished this is by doing away with high-level play altogether.
Yes, while the level range has increased by a "whopping" 10 levels, characters rarely do anything of import throughout those 30 levels. That isn't to say that this kind of play is bad; it isn't. It's just... really lame. Or at least, it is when compared to 10-20 of 3rd edition. My current campaign is quite like the way things are set up in 4th edition, but for D&D it's a step outside the norm for things to be this toned-down.
There are a number of welcome additions, though these ideas have been proposed by members of the gaming community and therefore are less original ideas from WotC and more neutered copycats. The most prominent in my eyes being the caveat for how civilization can thrive when most of the time they last for two weeks before the new chief of state is appointed by Holy Word right up the King's ass. That being: the world is largely a dark and twisted expanse filled with danger and magic saturates the whole of it. Some places more than others, and that is where we arrive at explanations for both how people survive for any length of time, and why anyone bothers with building shit. Everybody is living together in huddled fear of what's going to eat them next, but at least they can rest easy in their home city, or "points of light" as they are called in the DMG. What's also nice is a retuning of the economy, though to what extent that retuning fixes the bullshit is unclear to me at present.
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
34 comments:
Oh yeah. There is something for everyone to do, nobody will be sitting on their hands during an encounter. Not only that, but with the powers for each class come more choices and freedom that only make your character more and more unique while still maintaining in-game usefullness. In 4e you have to actively work to make a "bad" character and I think that's one of the greatest strengths of this game.
I also like the fact that each race has something not only useful, but "cool", that makes it worth playing.
The Eladrin can teleport each encounter as a minor action? Radical.
Half-elves can take an at-will from another class? Can you say Rogue with Eyebite as a once per encounter?
There also seems to be a big focus on reducing the DM's workload, but at the same time allowing him/her to say "Yes, you can" more and more often.
So, yeah, I'm eagerly waiting for the books to come off the truck and show up on my shelving cart at work so I can put my set aside.
Said podcast, incidentally, is hysterical. Jim Dark-fell-ominous-magic is the best name for any character.
"GM Dark Magic? Why don't you just call yourself Chet Awesomelaser?"
By the way, Mike was *totally* me.
"Okay so...which number is the modifier?"
Ah the memories are coming back...
Fey Step is a move action. Having not playtested said system with any great rigor, I can't say for sure how useful the ability really is in practice. For most times, it seems to be good for just avoiding AoO's for a turn to set up flanking or when moving out of reach.
Well man I have no real clue of what is going on with all the 4th edition crap but I'll wait to make opinon on it when we play.
Oh And Bryan do you got Conan yet?
According to Amazon, it'll arrive on Wednesday ;)
So when are we thinking is good for the next game? If we want to keep going with SAME, I am more than prepared for it. If not, material can easily be mustered for such.
Like always, I am free after 5 on Friday through the weekend.
Also, Bryan. Did my work help your situation any? Or is there still feedback/slowdown from time to time?
And join the private server.
Umm I will probally have some free time to play this weekend however I know Cody is going on a fishing trip From Wednesday to Sunday so we would have to take that into account.
Man Bryan that game fucking rules let me tell ya.
Hehe, what server ye be on?
He be on Ajujo, with me.
Sweet, it came a day early :) w00tzorz.
Installing now :P
Saturday is no good for me but that's it.
It seems Wizards is enforcing the 4e street date this week. The boxes came in today marked "Do not sell until 6/6/08". So much for scoring them early.
Physically at any rate...
Yeah, I suppose. I'm content to just have it on my computer.
Call me a stickler or a curmudgeon, but I don't plan on buying the new books. I know it's become sort of passe, and predictable for me to be overtly cynical and critical of something like this, but I am honestly not impressed after even more time with the game.
It's a logistical nightmare, it's magic item system is even more retarded than 3rd (You get a whole 1 more enchancement bonus, but the goddamn +6 version of something costs 3 million more gp? What the fuck? Who was writing this crap?). Why do monsters' HP scale drastically with level while player's attacks don't pick up the slack to make up for it? What the fuck is a 15th level Wizard, who averages 21 base damage with his daily power Blast of Cold supposed to do against a Rakshash with 142 hit points? And if this is a standard encounter, there's going to be one for each of the party. In the new standard that's five of the fuckers. Five. That's 710 hit points that a party of 5 needs to wade through before they're done with them. Granted, that brings them halfway to the next level, but who the hell thought that a combat that lasts 4 fucking hours was a good idea? The language of an MMO does not translate well to dice, and I don't think Wizards understands that.
God... the core mechanics are fine, but its exceptions should not punish players for advancing. I should not feel like I am getting worse at dealing with my opponents, nor should I feel gipped when my last weapon upgrade is another 5 other weapons from different groups because one more step up is seriously 2 and a half million gp when a level lower is 500k.
Well now, a but angry are we Josh. Deep brethes settle down it's just a game that is gonna for the most part totally blow. As to when I'm free Sats a no go till after work so 9ish and sunday I work from 3-7 I believ but I will check today and post the for sure time up
A similar encounter in 3.5 might only last a round or two because the Wizard is able to summon something crazy or meteor swarm them into oblivion while the other party members watch.
The difference in this 4e encounter is that the rest of the party can do all of things the wizard can. Assuming a party of five vs. five of the Rakshasa Warriors as you mention.
Glancing at the Level 15 powers for the other classes, it's not unreasonable to assume 20 damage per person per round. There'll probably be misses of course, but that should be made up for by other effects. The Blast of Cold for example, will be immobilizing (or at least slowing) each one caught in the blast.
So each round, our party will be doing about 70 - 110 damage a round which only translates to about eight to ten rounds to eat through 710 HP of tiger-people. The enemies may be hitting us just as well of course, but we've got something they don't - healing surges. And if the Cleric or Paladin is doing his job, you won't even have to slow down to use them.
One of the things I keep hearing about the game is shorter rounds, but more of them. Powers and abilities are far easier to execute in this game than in 3.5. So I would argue that four hours is a bit of an exaggeration.
Oh Josh, didn't see your question :P
It worked until you left, apparently. So it's pretty much where it was before you did anything.
I'm also thinking of upgrading to this in terms of graphics (8800 GS):
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150275
Thoughts? It's going for $120 so it sounds like a good deal.
Are you kidding? Of course 4 hours is an exaggeration, but I am not wrong when I say that their combat scheme is bullshit. Combats take longer and longer to resolve, and the characters never do anything interesting aside from move some people around and juggle some numbers. I was being kind to the party with those Rakshasa, if we went with the DMG's default level 15 encounter they'd be fighting 5 Angels of Battle, who each have 296 HP. Or if we went with another setup, they'd be fighting an Adult Red Dragon, with 750 HP, high defenses and all kinds of stupid "I feel like killing you now" abilities. And to maintain the damage output you assume, they need to be spending their Daily powers each turn, because they're normal encounter powers aren't cutting the slack in that department. And we're supposed to go through ten of these goddamn encounters to get to the next level?
Sure, now everybody has save-or-be-inconvenienced powers and everybody is roughly on the same level, but mostly I am just mad that WotC was flat out lying when they told us they were streamlining combat. Sure, everythging's much, much simpler now; hit, run, hit, run, hit, etc. But that's not combat. That's whack-a-mole.
I'll play the game, and I'm sure I'll have fun doing it, but right now I am just livid that nothing was fixed. Or, at least, nothing was fixed that needed to be.
Oh, and the card's specs seem fine, though I would've looked for one with a higher clock speed. Just make sure that you're motherboard has a PCIEx16 slot on it before you buy it.
Ok SO I work till close on Sunday which is 8 but I know cody ius getting back sunday sometime. If not than on Mon I work 3-7. Simple mix up but it's up to you man.
You have to simplify if you want to streamline. There's no way around that. Combat actions that were practically entire game systems unto themselves have been consolidated to work with the basic system.
Combat will always be some variation of moving and hitting, but now it's all on the same system of Attack Roll X against Defense Y will cause Negative Effects A, B and C. I can definitely see how that sort of thing can be seen as a negative, but it works for me.
I think I like the example encounters listed in each Monster Manual entry than what the DMG is showing me. The Level 15 encounter example they give for an Angel of Battle seems perfectly manageable for a five-person party with their roles all straightened out. As opposed to the Wolf Pack example of 5 Angels. Not sure what that disjunct is all about.
We can discuss this further if you wish, in person, but I'd rather not make myself out to be more of an ass any further than I already am.
Regardless, we can play on either day, but we wouldn't be playing SAME. Since I'd want everybody around for it, and only one of the party is available Saturday and two on Sunday, I don't think that proposition is substantial.
So, we have several options available, and you are free to discuss whatever you might think to be an appropriate game at your leisure. The ideas from earlier last month are still available, as I still have the document I produced for them, along with any of the other ideas from before. Any game, really, I don't care. I just want to play something.
If Friday's good, I'd want to convene then.
If not, we'll just have to wait another week or something.
Umm Friday I'll be in Hartford at my cousins but perhaps I can see if you gents can come and we can just play a d&d game as you aformentioned. Otherwise I Know I'm open and free next Friday
I will have a answer for you guys tonight if it's cool and than it'll be up to you guys if you wanna come
If it's alright, I'll come along. Just tell me what I need to prepare, and I assume I'll just bum a ride with you.
Prepare what ever you want to Josh he said it was cool and Alexd let me know if yer in or not. Than we can leave whenever you guys are ready to go
No, I mean system-wise. What is he running?
Level loadout, etc.
Doesn't really matter. We'll play whatever I guess. I mean I aint picky.
Thanks, but I think I'm going to sit this one out. Stuff to do tomorrow and I don't want to be out late.
Wouldn'tbe out too late probally like 11 or so
When are the cool kids hanging out?
Wouldn't know; we're not cool.
Guys guys, I hear Kung Fu Panda is the SEX.
Post a Comment